Wait for news reports, but fresh off the wire is that PY shared with Scott Miller on his radio show tonight that Calgary is bolting!!!!
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baseballfever |
Vipers gone |
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Wait for news reports, but fresh off the wire is that PY shared with Scott Miller on his radio show tonight that Calgary is bolting!!!!
Last Edited By: baseballfever 20-Sep-07 12:42:24.
Edited 1 time.
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fanfromcowtown |
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wow......... I do hope this is another case of PY speaking out of turn.
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pleasevoteforpedro |
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According to the In-Forum, there will be
news tomorrow but Young alluded to this earlier tonight:
Google news shows this as being posted at 11:33 pm central. |
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cra218 |
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if the vipers bolt what happens to the cats ? either they stay or saskatoon replaces calgary or they both go
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98Champs |
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WDAY-6 reported that Peter Young hinted at Calgary joining the Golden League and made the assumption that Edmonton would join the GBL with them. That seems to
make sense.
I can only assume that a NoL/AA merger is not too far off, at the least a defection of some AA teams back to the NoL. If they don't do it for the 2008 season they may have to go to a 6 team/1 division league for one season. So much for the "premier" independent league label. |
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HorseRaider |
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98Champs wrote:If you don't have a link, then you are "assuming". We all what happens when we "assume" things that we have no proof of. Until we see facts, then starting the old "AA is going to break up" rumor again is nothing but another item on somebody's wish list, IMHO. BTW, I am not some NL hater. I'm one of the people pulling for the NL to stay together. It's the granddaddy of Indy leagues and it would't be right for the NL to NOT be around in some form or fashion.
Last Edited By: HorseRaider
20-Sep-07 23:20:16.
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nlfan |
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First the PY quote
That they won't be in Minneapolis for the meeting doesn't mean they won't be represented. NoL owners have "called in" to those meetings. On the other hand, given how he handled the travel subsidy, I think the intent of his comment means what we all think it means. A fuller story From the Calgary Herald: Vipers eye Golden horizons Note: This article is from Gidney, not PY. Big quotes (emphasis added): Gidney has to make a decision, in conjunction with Edmonton Cracker-Cats owner Dan Orlich, about where his team will play baseball next season.Meaning... the Vipers and C-Cats are a "package deal." They pretty much have to go together or travel costs go nut for both clubs (and leagues). (And crazi will you forget Toon Town already --it's a dead even if only ONE club left) Stop dreaming The AA clubs are never coming back to the NoL, period. Nothing has changed in the NoL to make any of them want to come back. Why would anyone in their right mind want to buy into the NoL these days? All of this press and activity is doing some real damage to the league. The NoL clubs are the ones who would try to get into the AA and most of the league --especially the southern division clubs-- aren't all that interested. The AA is expanding and/or improving with a new ballpark in Grand Prairie and getting Wichita. The AA has little or no need for the NoL clubs. The NoL's "go it alone/we know best" approach and general disdain for the departed clubs and other leagues has done little to help. If they haven't started making overtures to the AA, they may run out of time. The AA owners meeting is the same weekend and they have to make their own plans for 2008 and can't/won't wait (long) for the NoL to figure its own problems out. Brinksmanship ...again... this time with Gidney. The rest of the article is covers the same topics... "bad 2008 schedule, travel subsidies must die." They also finally make public the GBL option: So unless he sees something better prior to a league meeting on Oct. 5 in Minneapolis, Gidney won't rule out the possibility of his team playing in the California-based Golden League next year.The last (emphasized) quote is the only sign that the GLB is not "done deal" for the Vipers --but not going to the meeting just makes it clear they want a lot of concessions "or else." Given Sam's last comments (including that the Chicago clubs "wouldn't shed a tear"), it's hard to say which way things will go. It's hard to believe the (remaining) owners would want to cave in to the AB clubs unless forced into the matter. In all of this GBL itself hasn't made any public comments about expanding to AB. There's been precious little from their end about any of this --and they're the most important part. As with the AA's schedule, this will have to be resolved soon so, if the AB clubs do bolt, the GBL can work out their 2008 plans accordingly. More defections? And then there's this bomb in that same article: The Northern League may be on tenuous ground anyways, as two teams in the Chicago area are rumoured to be looking at a move to the Frontier League.Hmm... here's the FL rumor again (one, unlike that idiotic and asinine "wet dream" that "Lawless" promotes does not die). I wonder which Chicago clubs would be involved with this? And... how quickly will Clark, Sam, and/or Bill (Lee) get on the record about either story.
For those new to this rumor...
It goes "Gary & Schaumburg leave for the FL while Joliet goes for affiliated ball." Joliet may like the idea of being an affiliate, but that's nearly impossible in the short team (and all those MiLB contracts are quite well known in the public record). So if it's only two, then it could be any pair of the three. The alternate rumor is that all three would bolt for the cheaper and more convenient FL. All of this has been denied when raised both this year and last. News from Fargo? I think it should also be noted that this news broke in Fargo, not Winnipeg. WDAY is the radio home of the RedHawks and the IN-Forum is the website for the "The Forum" newspaper --the main newspaper in Fargo. Isn't curious how there's nothing from Winnipeg --the main source of NoL news-- on this subject (so far)? It suggests that PY & Co. are either specifically bypassing the usual outlets (in "Sam's Town"), the Peg press is not interested in the story or simply missed this morning's press deadline for the print run. Maybe more will break on this story before the meeting --perhaps another comment from "hizzonor."
Last Edited By: nlfan
21-Sep-07 00:44:41.
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nlfan |
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Continuing from other topics...
I agree that reheating the FL rumor, especially in a 2-team version, seems unrealistic. As with the GBL, they're not talking (publicly) about anything --at least not from Bill Lee (unlike the story earlier this season from Rockford where an FL owner went on the record about it). This could be part of a PY smokescreen. That said... it shouldn't be surprising to anyone that one or more of the Chicago clubs, seeing the NoL imploding, might investigate other options. If the NoL implodes down to 6 clubs a lot of their investment in it is gone. The AB clubs aren't all that happy about signing into a 12-team league that's now only 8. Why should anyone who bought into a 10-team NoL be satisfied with only 6? Also, if the other clubs bolt, the 3 Chicago clubs votes would make up 50% of the votes. They could (in theory) overturn the $1M penalty and "get out of NoL free." Whatever the case... this is becoming a real mess. I wonder if/when Clark, Sam or someone will make some other comments from the league's side. With the GBL and FL involved, maybe we'll hear something from their commissioners --they certainly had no problems getting Lee to to squash the FL rumor earlier this year. |
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Pietsch Fan |
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I seriously doubt if the GBL will say anything until it's a done deal.
Mary
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samuelclemens |
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this is just an observation. but from what i have heard, read and observed over the last 2-3 years it seems as though the current batch of owners are going in at least a few different directions. for 3 teams to bolt and one to opt to fold rather than stay in the NL speaks volumes. how do you go from being the benchmark in the industry to basically a skidmark in 2-3 seasons? the issues revolve around money. and as in any business when you have huge expenses where there were once nominal ones, then eyebrows are going to be raised and questions asked. this league, like most other minor leagues, is budgeted for bus rides. air travel is a huge expense, especially on short notice. i believe the calgary/edmonton experiment looked very exciting and promising at first. imagine a league literally spanning 2/3 - 3/4 of North America. cities falling all over themselves to fill the gaps in between current teams. all looks good on paper and sounds good when you say it out loud. BUT, canada is not a baseball first society (nothing personal against CAL, EDM or WPG but WPG is the only one to put people in the seats). hockey rules in calgary and edmonton. and the midwest is saturated with minor league teams already. then add in owner egos and pride. well, I am not surprised anymore. i wish the wichita option had worked out because then you only need one more team. and even if it was a stop gap for a season or two, i am sure some city in canada could/would have opened its arms to the league. so if PY is finally saying something of substance, then the remaining owners have no one to blame but themselves for these headaches they will go through for the next 2-3 months. i have no doubt they will land on their feet in some league or suck it up and do the 6 team league for 2008 and the fans will still support their teams. but a perfectly good league has been turned into a maury povich show. |
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nlfan |
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"Mr. Twain," you've made some excellent points and I fully agree.
At times (some of) the owners have acted, in the words of a recent NoL commissioner, like "Steinbrenner-wannabes." Having recently watched the ESPN-C series The Bronx is Burning, that seems all the more apt when you have different factions/owners arguing their internal issues in the press. We'll have to see if there's (yet) another split (technically shrinking from 18 to 12 to 8 to 6 in the course of six seasons) or they can actually "kiss and make up" to save their collective teams (and investments). I still (want to) doubt they'll split but can/will they really put all this behind them? We'll have wait two to find out (unless they decide something sooner). |
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nlfan |
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Fargo video clip
Someone told me to look around for a clip about PY's comments and I found it on WDAY TV Sports (which got the story from the radio) and can be played from this link. About all it adds is that they tried to contact Big Bruce (and Josh) but they weren't available for comment (for broadcast). Apparently PY, in the original radio interview extended the conversation, possibly more than intended. Of course none of this does anything with Gidney's comments in the Calgary article. |
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Doc Halladay |
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Obviously the Vipers and Crackercats are working in concert. Neither league would be interested in just one team, and as it is, only partial interest in both
for a litany of logistical reasons.
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Zeyes |
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nlfan wrote: And more generally speaking, the 3 Chicago + the 2 Alberta clubs constitute a majority, as long as they're still all there anyway. |
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cra218 |
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if a joliet wants to go to the mwl their are a couple of clubs in the windy city that might not be too happy with the idea ( the cubs n white soxs)
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mtl09 |
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all I know is unless the frontier league dumps that age limit....I wouldn't go that route for the hammers and
the majority of fans here agree on that........actually the talk here was a couple of frontier league teams coming over to the northern league........who knows....... and when the team was setup here the GOAL was to be affiliated within 7 years....according to the city of joliet.........now that I like..... mike |
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MJHankel |
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The age thing is about the only problem I see with the Frontier League as an option, seeing as how some of the favorites may not be able to remain.
As it is I don't see this being an issue, unless something big happens in this off season. I am looking forward to seeing more NoL baseball at the Steel Yard.
Last Edited By: MJHankel
21-Sep-07 12:47:46.
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MJHankel |
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Griffith has at least come forward to state his opinion of the matter on In-Forum:
"I think we'll move ahead as eight teams and we'll try to make it 10," Though I know he needs to say that sense it is of course good for PR to claim stability, I am glad he at least said something after all of this. Without waiting silent, like the league has done with some of the rumors floating around. There was also this little fun tidbit to clear things up:
Last Edited By: MJHankel
21-Sep-07 13:07:16.
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cra218 |
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crazi like a fox maybe for truth be told the cubs n w/soxs probably wouldnt mind if kanc county wasnt around and they sure dont want another mwl club around as
i see it . as for the nol going to 10 teams and an fl nl memger of sorts by some fl teams jmping ship to the nol i cant see that due to the travel .
nevertheless some fl / nl defections are interesting and might happen as the travel situation in the fl isnt all that rosey . if the nol odes expand outside of
getting some fl clubs where do they go ?
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Irwinboy |
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Joining affiliated ball is not an easy process. First and foremost, under the MLB/MiLB rules, the Chicago area independent clubs would need to get the
approval of the Cubs, White Sox AND the Midwest League (Kane County Cougars). THEN... they would have to PURCHASE AN EXISTING MIDWEST LEAGUE FRANCHISE AND
RELOCATE IT. A club cannot merely, "join" affiliated baseball. Affiliated teams and leagues are capped by the major/minor league agreement signed
in 1991 and renewed many times over. Thus NO EXPANSION exists. If you look at affiliated baseball, all franchise movement in the last 16 years is a result of
franchise RELOCATION. So.... if Joliet wants to get a farm club, they will have to get the approval of the aforementioned organizations, AND purchase the
franchise of Beloit, Clinton, or some other struggling Midwest League team, which in the current market would cost them something over $2 million and maybe as
much as $4 million. Hardly a prudent move, and doggone near impossible.
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mtl09 |
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as far as approval.....thats based on how close you are to a club or franchise now.......
there is a milage requirement...as you have to be so many miles away from another club......if not then approval is needed.......if memory serves me correctly we are just outside that area..... as I said.....the "goal" was 7 years.........and for money..........not a problem............... mike |
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